THP-E182: Unlocking Risk Vs Reward For Hydrogen Companies. Also, Major Syn Fuels Deal Might Be The Blueprint For Aviation.

January 19, 2023 • Paul Rodden • Season: 2023 • Episode: 182

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Welcome to The Hydrogen Podcast!

In episode 182, A new article discussing businesses getting into the hydrogen space and the risks that they should know about. I’ll cover the article and give my thoughts as well as covering a new press release from Raven SR, all of this on today’s hydrogen podcast.

Thank you for listening and I hope you enjoy the podcast. Please feel free to email me at with any questions. Also, if you wouldn’t mind subscribing to my podcast using your preferred platform… I would greatly appreciate it.

Paul Rodden



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Start Here: The 6 Main Colors of Hydrogen


A new article discussing businesses getting into the hydrogen space and the risks that they should know about. I’ll cover the article and give my thoughts as well as covering a new press release from Raven SR, all of this on today’s hydrogen podcast.

So the big questions in the energy industry today are, how is hydrogen the primary driving force behind the evolution of energy? Where is capital being deployed for hydrogen projects globally? And where are the best investment opportunities for early adopters who recognize the importance of hydrogen? I will address the critical issues and give you the information you need to deploy capital. Those are the questions that will unlock the potential of hydrogen and this podcast will give you the answers. My name is Paul Rodden and welcome to the hydrogen podcast.

In an article in power Blanca Berreguete writes green hydrogen bu sinesses should know the potential and the risks. Blanca writes, from the Apollo space missions to the Zeppelin airships human ingenuity has long dreamed up ways to make the power of hydrogen fly. Now as the world powers up to reach climate goals in the midst of an energy crisis, the universe’s most abundant element is once again taking up airtime as debate continues over its usage and feasibility as part of a secure low carbon future. recent innovations have included French transport giant Alstom’s fleet of hydrogen powered trains in Germany and Siemens planned rollout of a hydrogen train with Deutsche Bahn in 2024. Rolls Royce and Airbus are researching a feasibility of hydrogen powered aircraft. Hydrogen is a big selling factor is that unlike hydrocarbons, it produces no carbon dioxide when burned only water vapor. But most hydrogen today is produced using natural gas or methane, which doesn’t make greenhouse gases as a result.

Now this is known as gray hydrogen, whereas green hydrogen relies on energy from renewable sources like wind or solar and as emissions free. Now, I think this statement needs a little more clarification. So according to the industry, green doesn’t just mean that the energy being used is renewable, like wind and solar but also that it’s using water as the feedstock and separating that into hydrogen and oxygen. Blanca continues there is potential in green hydrogen to decarbonize high polluting sectors such as heavy industry, steel production, mining and trucking, as well as powering mobility hydrogen allows energy to be stored, distributed or transported for conversion to electricity. More than 70 countries around the world have national hydrogen strategies, and it is estimated hydrogen could meet up to 24 of the world’s energy needs by 2050. In 2021, however, the globally installed green hydrogen capacity was only around 300 megawatts, the equivalent of one gas turbine or less than the globally installed solar PV capacity 20 years ago, widespread take up of the technology will require large scale building of electrolysis plants with export infrastructure, storage and transportation facilities.

Swedish venture Hybrit in 2021, announced that it had supplied Volvo was steel used in trucks made using green hydrogen, and recently, Stockholm based h2 Green steel announced it had secured three and a half billion euros or $3.75 billion in debt financing from European financial institutions to build a hydrogen power plant In northern Sweden. There are more than 100 pilot and demonstration projects for using green hydrogen and its derivatives and shipping this according to the IEA While, in the power sector projects involving the use of hydrogen and ammonia could result in a total capacity of three and a half gigawatts by 2030. The EU is driving green hydrogen and other renewables with its Green Deal. It recently announced the launch of a European hydrogen Bank, which will invest more than $3 billion dollars to support the hydrogen economy. And under its repower EU plan. It aims to import 10 million tons of renewable hydrogen by 2030 and produce 10 million tons domestically. However, some of the biggest hydrogen plants we’ve seen in the pipeline recently have been in the US and the Middle East. Growth and green hydrogen is being propelled by stakeholder pressure on business to decarbonize netzero commitments and the need to reduce reliance on Russian gas. It is anticipated that the cost of production will come down.

As hydrocarbon costs rise, renewable costs continue to fall higher production capacity creates economies of scale and government support development with subsidies. The International hydrogen trade is set to pick up speed from 2035. According to a report from IRENA, the International Renewable Energy Agency, which envisages two thirds of green hydrogen production in 2050. Being used locally and 1/3 traded across borders. The agency sees green hydrogen competing on cost with blue by the end of this decade, countries Chile Morocco Namibia are poised to become green hydrogen exporters. While hydrocarbon fuel exporters such as the UAE, Australia, Oman and Saudi Arabia have the potential to pivot to green hydrogen production as well as blue hydrogen importers are likely to include Japan, South Korea and parts of Europe and Latin America. China is the world’s biggest consumer and producer of hydrogen, using 24 million tons a year followed by the US, which pledged nine and a half billion dollars and its 2021 infrastructure bill for the country’s fledgling clean hydrogen sector.

Companies operating in the green hydrogen space also face new risks because of the need to use prototype technologies. And the risk that implementation involves possible infrastructure challenges. This is just one example of the new world of risks that we’re entering. The scale up of hydrogen is also challenged by production costs, land availability, and the construction or repurposing of infrastructure, evolving technologies storage, now this being of hydrogen itself and the energy it generates, and water scarcity. As with other energy industries, fire and explosion is a major peril. Hydrogen gas is a very small molecule, so it’s easy for it to escape. You can’t see it or smell it, it’s highly flammable, and when ignited, the flames are almost invisible. Around 25% of hydrogen fires are the result of leaks. So proper handling is essential. The appropriate fire safety and detection equipment should be available and care must be taken with the design of electrical installations, including reducing ignition sources and buildings to minimize gas confinement and subsequent explosions. Hydrogen can be produced almost anywhere, and it can be centralized or decentralized. There will be new, less experienced operators in the market and some will operate remotely using remote monitoring technologies, perhaps, and repurposed facilities.

Green hydrogen plants also need to ensure consistent sources of renewable energy or risk business interruption losses if they lose power. Now before going on to the last section, I want to touch on a couple of things that she mentions here. And that is that these challenges are real. As hydrogen becomes more a part of our day to day lives, regulations really do need to be put in place to ensure safety protocols are being followed. And when she talks about hydrogen production being able to be made anywhere centralized or decentralized, that’s a big selling point for the hydrogen economy. And it does mean as she said that operators in the market, some will be operating remotely, and they’re going to be less experienced. And so what I envision in the future is that a lot of these smaller operators, their success is going to be reliant on who they’re partnering with in the hydrogen industry. There are a lot of larger players in the hydrogen industry right now think Exxon, Chevron, and a lot of the other super majors that know how to deal with hydrogen. But a lot of these projects that are coming up right now are just too small for them to focus on right now. And so that means smaller operators can partner with these larger companies, and begin laying down the framework and foundation to set up these decentralized hydrogen hubs.

And lastly, Blanca writes, although green hydrogen is an emerging industry, there have already been losses in the marketplace related to hydrogen fueling stations, and hydrogen escaping, followed by explosions because the flanges were not assembled and tightened correctly. With new players entering into the industry new risks will enter the value chain. The reputation of suppliers and manufacturers must be assured particularly as the production of green hydrogen is developing new technology and materials to reduce costs. It is essential, robust risk management protocols are in place. As the industry quickly evolves, the green hydrogen industry is only taking off with the established oil and gas players investing heavily. The journey to a netzero future is a fast pace, and it’s likely green hydrogen will have an important role in getting there. Green hydrogen can impact all types of sectors. So it will be crucial for businesses to understand both the complex risks and potential it can provide. Okay, so a good overview from Blanca Berreguete on this emerging hydrogen economy and some of the risks associated with getting into this industry right now. Now I realize she focuses a lot on green hydrogen, but the fact remains that hydrogen is going to be made from essentially three different sources hydrocarbons, water and waste. All three of them have huge potential. And really only time will tell about how fast cost parity will hit between electrolyzed hydrogen and a hydrocarbon hydrogen.

And next in another huge announcement from Raven SR. Raven SR. agrees to supply sustainable aviation fuel to All Nippon airways Raven Sr, renewable fuels company today, January 17, announced it has signed a memorandum of understanding to supply sustainable aviation fuel to All Nippon Airways or ana for major global routes. The MOU provides for an initial 50,000 tonnes of SAF supply in the first year 2025 with annual incremental increases to 200,000 tonnes for year 10. The supply will be produced by Raven SR and facilities plan for major global markets outside Japan to serve specific international routes of ANA, and a quote from Matt Murdock, CEO of Raven Sr. We are grateful our strategic partner, Itochu introduced us to ANA to initiate this landmark agreement for long term SAF supplies that will foster growth for Raven SR on a global basis and help ana with its carbon reduction commitments. He continues by saying we expect that our agreement with ana to supply SAF and strategic markets globally will enable buying local fuel produced from local waste. We see growing interest in such efficiency and circularity and renewable fuel distribution for aviation and other transportation sectors.

Itochu is one of several strategic investors and privately held Raven Sr, and the two companies maintain a strong partnership including plans for commercial production and sale of renewable fuels worldwide. By converting various types of local waste such as green waste, municipal solid waste, organic waste, and methane from municipal solid waste into clean fuels. Raven SR offers a sustainable solution for the reliable and long term production of SAF and in a quote from Hideo Miyake, executive vice president at ANA overseeing procurement. As part of our climate transition strategies. Ana is dedicated to being an industry leader with our environment commitments. This announcement with Itochu and Raven SR, will be of great importance and support our mid and long term carbon reduction goals.

We look forward to collaboratively working together on this important business imperative of being environmentally conscious and developing local solutions that are beneficial to reducing our carbon footprint. The Japanese airline industry is required by the country’s General Assembly of the International Civil Aviation Organization, or ICAO to reach a goal of achieving net zero co2 emissions from aircraft by 2050. Starting in 2024, Japanese airlines must reduce or offset 15% of emissions from 2019 levels. Global SAF supply currently comprises point zero 3% of total jet fuel consumption due to a limited supply of feedstock like used cooking oils and tallow, Raven SR plans to commence commercial production of SAF by 2025 in California and expand SAF production by 200,000 tonnes a year until 2034. In the US, and Europe, Raven SR is used of waste as feedstock for its SAF production is expected to stabilize both the supply and pricing of SAF.

Additionally, the third generation synthetic SAF produced using Raven SRS proprietary technology is projected to reduce co2 emissions compared to conventional jet fuel and extend the lifespan of jet engines. Third generation SAF refers to synthetic aviation fuel that are produced from non traditional feedstocks, such as agricultural waste forest residues, and algae. These feedstocks are considered to be more sustainable and environmentally preferable than traditional feedstocks, such as hydrocarbons, as they do not contribute to greenhouse gas emissions or deplete finite resources. Third generation SAF’s also have the potential to significantly reduce the carbon footprint of the aviation industry, as they emit significantly lower levels of greenhouse gases during fuel production and use process compared to hydrocarbons.

The Raven SR technology is a non combustion thermal chemical reductive process that converts organic waste and landfill gas to hydrogen and Fisher Tropsch’s synthetic fuels. Unlike other hydrogen production technologies, it steam co2 Reformation does not require fresh water as a feedstock, the process is more efficient than conventional hydrogen production, and can deliver fuel with low to negative carbon intensity. Additionally, Raven SR’s our goal is to generate as much of its own power on site as possible to reduce reliance on the power grid and be independent of the grid. As modular design provides a scalable means to locally produce renewable hydrogen and synthetic liquid fuels from local waste. Alright, so a big congratulations to Raven. And this announcement is huge news for those of us following synthetic fuels. Now, I firmly believe that synthetic fuels are the best ways to begin introducing the energy transition to those who are still holdouts. And so I’m ecstatic to see ANA teamed up with Raven on this announcement.

All right, that’s it for me, everyone. If you have a second, I would really appreciate it if you could leave a good review on whatever platform it is that you listen to Apple podcasts, Spotify, Google, YouTube, whatever it is, that would be a tremendous help to the show. And as always, if you ever have any feedback, you’re welcome to email me directly at And as always, take care. Stay safe. I’ll talk to you later.

Hey, this is Paul. I hope you liked this podcast. If you did and want to hear more, I’d appreciate it if you would either subscribe to this channel on YouTube, or connect with your favorite platform through my website at Thanks for listening. I very much appreciate it. Have a great day.